“The difference between Socialism & Communism, is the AK 47 pointed at your head”. Vietnamese Immigrant.
1 Like
Do you have an example of a truly socialistic society where the people own the means of production. Jimsouth - probably in some monasteries, etc. Other than that, it really doesn’t work; and the reason it works in monasteries is, all involved are agreeable & never forced into that lifestyle. I’ve known many monks; and from what I gathered, they all seemed content. I do love the Trappist lifestyle. Trappist beer - Wikipedia
To be honest, Trappist products are more of a socialist - capitalist enterprise; but the order is also into serious charity work. https://youtu.be/X784gpj8Xog?t=2
That’s basically true, communism operates under overt authoritarian government. Eliminates private property and cash.
Btw, in Sanders flavor, democratic socialism, he supports private business/production, private property and expansion of what has ALREADY evolved in America.
And unless everyone involved with socialism, doesn’t share equally, down to the last cent; it ain’t socialism. Just more hypocrisy. You cannot tell me socialist leaders live as simply as the fools they drag into the mix.
Well that’s the point of Sanders view. It’s not straight up socialism. I’m satisfied you haven’t read his platform, it’s lengthy, and interviews where he has discussed it. It can’t be understood with cherry picked sound bites on Hannity and Carlson.
By supporting private means of production, the ownership of property, you leave the same room for incentive that has existed all along. In his vision, people who work harder, are innovative, and entrepreneurial still can have more as a result, it’s just a system where we continue to improve the lot of everyone, where everyone has basic needs met. Health, welfare and education.
That said, I personally would have some space between myself and Sanders in the realm of welfare reform. I supported Clinton’s personal responsibility act regarding welfare reform and I support the most recent welfare reform announced by the Trump administration. I would go even farther than either of them though. I would heartily support bringing back the WPA and CCC which provided needed aid to families, allowed families to retain dignity, and provided advancements to US infrastructure that were wonderful, as an outdoor enthusiast, I use them regularly still.
Oh, I don’t doubt Sanders does have visions. Myself, I worked for all I have. I earned all I have. I’m content with that. I never took a nickel from anyone. So who has the right to control my life; or to even suggest I live by their ideology? I do believe ( if someone is capable ), no worky, no eaty.
1 Like
Well that’s the point of Sanders view. It’s not straight up socialism.-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Jimsouth - Well, this covers it. Benjy Benjamin:
Now look! We’ve figured it seventeen different ways, and each time we figured it, it was no good, because no matter how we figured it, somebody don’t like the way we figured it! So now, there’s only one way to figure it. And that is, every man, including the old bag, for himself!
Well, I didn’t think you would actually read anything about it.
No ones suggesting your life would be controlled, that’s in the totalitarian state of communism that you keep conflating with democratic socialism.
Good, let Sanders or anyone else fuck with the masses; as long as I’m allowed to live by what has always seemed to work for me. I earned it; it’s mine. Easy. I owe no one.
Well that’s just wrong. Your tax burden existed long before sanders came along.
2 Likes
Believe me, being of sound mind, I have gone to extremes to reduce my tax burden considerably. I know, you cannot avoid Death or Taxes; but at least Death doesn’t get worse. I am a superb pipe fitter - plumber; and it’s amazing how people are willing to pay ( DRUM ROLL ) “cash” for superior work. Especially if they get a big break on the price. All I ask for ( up front ) is they allow me to pace myself. Now who wouldn’t give an extra week or two if they can cut the cost of a $20,000 whole house plumbing job, by 50 or 60 percent? I paid my dues in life, and I paid enough taxes. Let someone else pick up the slack. It’s fun to piss away money that you have paid no income tax on.
Remember, under federal control they probably had to endure the extra cost of, um, entertaining Congressional fact finding missions.
When I was young & roaming the country, I worked in Reno for about a year. I knew a some high class hookers; and most had involvements with politicians. Hey senator, do what you will, just not on my dime.
It is what it is Jim, there once was no income tax, the constitution makes no such provision, but with increasing demands for ever more social programs and services comes taxes. It’s what people want. Huge strides were made towards socialism during the FDR years and Americans ate it up. So popular was FDR that Americans elected him repeatedly until he died. And plenty more have come along since and we will continue in that direction.
But eventually, the Goose That Laid The Golden Egg, will have a coronary. You know, it’s impossible to tax a country into prosperity. Simple math. Then again, eat, drink, and be merry. Tomorrow never comes. Until it does.----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- I think the biggest problem is wanton waste. There are literally billions flushed, that could have gone to much better use. The War on Poverty was a total waste of trillions. No positive ground gained.
If LBJ’s war on poverty disaster had been distributed to Americans; each would have received about $80,000. Possibly more. So what happened to the money. Show me the magic. Well, we know about 93% had to have gone to blood sucking administration. Then occasionally a bone was thrown to the masses.
2 Likes
And there’s still no enumerated power for these federal socal welfare programs.