Oh fuck off.
You still can’t explain how this has benefited the United States. In fact, everyone who is pushing for war has been using the same old song and dance of a preemptive strike reminiscent of the bullshit that pulled us into Iraq.
If you are so convinced that this benefited the US, then provide an account of what “evidence” convinced you of this.
I explained in detail how it is to our benefit. Learn to read.
Evidence? Observation of the documented attacks by Iran since 1978 and their ongoing state sponsorship of terrorists targeting the US.
Yeah, I read your posts. No need to copy and paste them over and over again. I’m still not seeing how killing Soleimani thousands of miles away benefits the United States.
Provide direct evidence that supports your claim.
What direct evidence is it that would satisfy you?
We killed the man directly responsible for the deaths of hundreds of Americans and thousands wounded, along with him being tangentially responsible for about 80% of our casualties in Iraq and Afghanistan since they resulted from IED’s provided by Iran and/or built and placed by people Solemani’s Qds force directly trained and supported.
Don’t forget…he did 9/11 too.
Anyhow…so what you’re saying is that this was a revenge killing of no tactical value or strategic importance to the United States…which is precisely my point. This was not beneficial to the United States in any way. Israel wanted him dead and Trump did them a favor.
This is a keen observation.
There is a great deal of confusion concerning this action, if you begin from the premise that it was indeed the USA who assassinated Soleimani. If however you believe that it was Israel, and they asked (told) Trump to take the fall for their unilateral crime, this current confusion makes much more sense.
Soleimani had been on diplomatic business FOR THE USA when the drone strike took place. He was in Iraq at the USA’s behest. This points to the killing being done by Mossad, not least because of Netanyahu’s proclamation the day before.
Factor this in to the NYT literally reporting on the killing the day before it happened and you will see that they are framing this in the deliberate wrong way to set you down the wrong path.
There is absolutely no evidence to support such an insane theory.
I quite frankly don’t give a damn what you think. I am new here but it is readily apparent that you have an agenda and a narrative to push. Further engagement with you wouldn’t be a worthy pursuit. Nothing but a waste of time. Have a good evening.
EDIT: can someone please DM me on how to set someone on ignore? I don’t want my inbox filled up with talking points scraped from neoconservative websites and AIPAC literature. Thanks in advance.
My narrative is the truth, sorry you find it offensive.
Maybe the war he allegedly stopped was akin to the US stepping in after Israel/Mossad dusted Soleimani and DJT said “Don’t do it” leave my ■■■■ alone or I’ll open a glass factory in Tehran next week? Makes about as much sense as anything. I just read that Soleimani flew in commercial under the guise he was asked to participate in peace talks. Paralysis by over analysis I guess, Occam’s Razor, Trump did it and even he doesn’t know why.
The Iranian Twelver Shia Islam is the belief that the last Imam, Imam al-Mahdi, lives in occultation since 800 ad, and will reappear as the promised Mahdi, to bring justice to the world. Shortly after the Mahdi reappears, Jesus will also arrive and work under the instructions of the Mahdi. That Twelver Shia Islam sounds completely demonic, and like the arrival of the Anti-Christ. That satanic Muslim shit should be wiped off the face of the Earth. It’s a false belief that those muzzies are somehow a noble race of peace loving peoples. If the shoe was on the other foot those crazy towelheads would be outside your door yesterday killing and enslaving you without remorse.
It takes two to tango, and there’s only one irrational side in this potential conflict. There won’t be war unless the US does a lot more, unanswered by Iran, and specifically starts doing things that actually weaken Iran militarily. Killing a general, no matter how arguably talented, does not weaken Iran appreciably. You could take out the Pentagon without impairing US military power. You could take out the WH and you would actually increase US power, because a less impaired person would be in charge of US military capabilities.
But, killing a senior general is a fairly provocative act, as a symbol, as a marker of intent. So the side that has been wronged, Iran, gets all sorts of soft power benefits from it, as all the non-impaired actors rally to deter further irrational behavior by the US.
So far it seems to have squelched Iran’s internal unrest, as the nation rallies in the face of what would be war, were the US serious about following up on killing the general. That benefit will fade as it becomes more clear that this was the random act of a mercurial dotard, not part of any plan, and that Iran is not actually in imminent danger of anything. Well, that is how it will play out, just a lone irrational act that won’t have any follow-up, unless Bolton is able to parlay the hold his potential testimony has over Trump to get back in the game and organize a real war with Iran.
Iran also has so far managed to get the Iraqi legislature to vote a resolution asking the US to withdraw its military from that country. Was that in the cards before the US assassinated this general on Iraqi soil?
Iran might also get greater cooperation from Europe in evading US sanctions, even if it does acquire nuclear weapons. Was that in the cards before the US did this irrational act?
All Iran has to do to reap these and who knows what further benefits, is to not be as stupid as Trump. That shouldn’t be too hard. We’re only on the brink of war if the US pushes this stupidity much harder and further.
I don’t see anyone arguing that killing the top two guys resposnble for their terrorist and militia attacks is going to cripple them militarily.
It will however have a profound effect on the people replacing them who know their days are now numbered.
Keep in mind, this attack did not happen in a vacuum either it was if I remember right the 11th in a recent series of attacks targeting the terrorist training camps and militia positions occupied by those who have recently been responsible for a series of attacks on US interests, bases, and individuals including the attack on our embassy.
It takes a long time to build up an experienced cadre of leaders and taking them out absolutely does have a significant effect on their ability to conduct operations in the future.
If as reported it is also true that they were about to launch another series of significant attacks that had been discovered this was a very good way to interdict them and stop those attacks.
Personally I prefer being proactive rather than always sitting back taking the hits and retaliating, or worse, giving them a pass because a few lives here and there don’t really matter.
We’ve spent most of 40 years taking the hits and not responding militarily so obviously that wasn’t working since the tempo and severity of the attacks were increasing.
On Jan 2nd CIA ratfuck Steven Simon writes an OpEd for the NYT about the dangers of hypersonic missiles in modern warfare. In the article he hypotheticaly uses Gen Suleimani in a situation where one might be used to take him out. While attending a meeting. In Bagdahd.
Jan 3rd. Gen Suleimani gets smoked. By a missile. While attending a meeting. In Bagdahd.
Just another coincidence right?
Source:
There is no evidence. It’s an unnecessary escalation that has completely taken attention away from Trump’s impending senate impeachment trial.
Trump promised to extract the US from the Middle East as a KEY campaign promise. He pointed out that the US had already wasted 7 trillion dollars in the region and that waste was going to end.
The reality is our presence is greater since he became president, another borrowed trillion dollars has been wasted in the region, troop buildups have been going on all year, Trump has vetoed a strong bipartisan bill that would end US involvement in the bloody civil war in Yemen. As with most of his big promises, Again, the Trump supporter has been deluded…
The ME - Muslim world has been totally around the bend for decades - centuries. This is just one more of many many many bumps in the road. Seems like one step forward, dozens of steps back. I think humanities last word will be “why”? In fact, Roger Whittaker did a song called WHY; and Tom Paxton did “Whose Garden Was This”?
Ok. It’s a new decade. Let’s stop with this kind of baseless accusation. It is as predictable as it is unfounded. I consider myself to be a classical liberal and am truly growing tired of this type of rhetoric being tossed around carelessly whenever the state of Israel or it’s citizens are fairly criticized or their motives are questioned.
Israel is a sovereign country (with it’s own wants and needs) that is largely dependent upon the taxpayers of the United States. All people born ■■■■■■ are entitled to citizenship in the state of Israel, regardless of country of birth. Bringing this up isn’t anti-Semitism or hatred. It’s a fact and it’s a major component of the Israeli immigration and citizenship system. It is also something that should be scrutinized as it relates to those who hold dual Israeli-US citizenship and elected, military, or bureaucratic positions of power in the United States. All Americans should be skeptical of this and ask questions as it is deeply concerning.
With regard to this Iran issue, let’s speak plainly about it. The US in no way, shape, or form derives any benefit from getting involved in a protracted war with Iran. We all know that Israel wants Iran destroyed just as much as Iran wants Israel destroyed. Those two neighboring countries have had a simmering rivalry for as long as I can remember. Neither side is innocent in their aggression towards one another. I think the point that many here are making is that the US does not need to get involved with it, not when there are so many major problems to fix here at home.
So please, for the sake of everyone trying to have an honest discussion, please stop throwing around these types of ridiculous accusations.
I agree; we should get out of the shit & begin to clean up all the messes at home, as quickly as possible. With the stipulation: We are leaving, and you can sort out your own problems; but if you fuck with us, when we finish with you, you will believe you have met SATAN.
I think that is a fair and reasonable proposition. See - who says liberals and conservatives can’t agree on something.
This is more obvious than the nose on ones face. But there remain those imbedded in our political system that have wanted Iranian regime change for decades. Just as they wanted for Syria. We have known for over a decade now of pentagon plans to conduct regime change in all the countries we have been militarily active in. And of course, some members of this forum are supportive of that as well.
