I do hope that you are sincere in your motive.
I try this again with trepidation, but also hope.
I am! I am not really debating this question, I am just listening and forming my own insights to this question. I am little bit clearer on this question thanks to people’s explanation.
What are your thoughts regarding this question? Do you have anything to add?
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This is spot on.
Amplifying, after feeding the a crowd before Passover, in John Chapter 6, the following occurs:
Jesus answered them and said, “Truly, truly, I say to you, you seek Me, not because you saw signs, but because you ate of the loaves and were filled. 27 Do not work for the food which perishes, but for the food which endures to eternal life, which the Son of Man will give to you, for on Him the Father, God, has set His seal.” 28 Therefore they said to Him, “What shall we do, so that we may work the works of God?” 29 Jesus answered and said to them, “This is the work of God, that you believe in Him whom He has sent.” 30 So they said to Him, “What then do You do for a sign, so that we may see, and believe You? What work do You perform? 31 Our fathers ate the manna in the wilderness; as it is written, ‘He gave them bread out of heaven to eat.’” 32 Jesus then said to them, “Truly, truly, I say to you, it is not Moses who has given you the bread out of heaven, but it is My Father who gives you the true bread out of heaven. 33 For the bread of God is [i]that which comes down out of heaven, and gives life to the world.” 34 Then they said to Him, “Lord, always give us this bread.”
35 Jesus said to them, “I am the bread of life; he who comes to Me will not hunger, and he who believes in Me will never thirst. 36 But I said to you that you have seen Me, and yet do not believe. 37 All that the Father gives Me will come to Me
Clearly Jesus has fed these people to provide a metaphor for Salvation, and when they come back for more food, he scolds them.
This is not any economic lesson, it is a metaphor for Salvation.
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If you encounter another person spouting the nonsense of “Jesus is a communist / socialist / anticapitalist”, share with them Jesus’ Parable of the Talents
To make my point succinct and short, the point of the parable is: to each according to his abilities, but not according to his need. It is a direct contradiction from:
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A more persuasive argument that has sometimes been used to associate Christianity with Socialism is found in the Pauline epistles (writings of Paul) about the early Church sharing. However, there is no top-down compelling of people to do donate particular things, do particular jobs, or control of production. There is faith that God will lay the needs of the Church on those with means.
As I have frequently said to the cracker-jack Marxists when they try to leverage my faith to convert me:
Forced charity is no virtue.
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What about "tithing? What are your thoughts about this? I hear a lot of conflicting explanations on this, (not in regards to Socialism) but the need for it and why its important to be consistent in tithing.
Yeah I noticed that too, one of his many incarnations no doubt!
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Tithing is clearly guidance.
I take from it several things:
The Lord’s yoke is easy, not overly burdensome.
It is to support the local church, and evangelism, and ministry not an ever growing welfare system. It does not grow, except by the Lord’s provision of abundance.
It clearly points out hucksters that continually ask for money.
I could go on, but that is the gist of it.
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I usually asked them right back: please show me a major socialist country in the past that embraced Christianity / Catholicism. And please explain these:
http://metrovoicenews.com/christians-under-attack-by-communist-vietnam/
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Forced charity equates to taxing (confiscating) and redistributing.
Voluntary charity is giving to those in need.
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Ok. So the saying give with your heart with no expectations of return is the more poignant aspect to tithing?
Amen.
and some more chars…
What I find is most interesting about Asian countries especially China, is that Christianity is the fastest rising religion in all of Asia currently. So maybe there is something to this aspect that governments feel threatened by it. As is the muslim population in the Northwest part of China as well.
Tithing is also voluntary…as is faith. The Lord does not demand that you tithe or have faith…just promises that each will be rewarded.
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Lived in Vietnam for the first 14 years of my life, in a religiously-involved family, and I’ll say this: asian Catholics are the most ardent anti-communists there are. Why? Bc the communist doctrine goes directly against that of Catholic / Christian, in a few reasons stated above (theory and practices). Plus, communist regime usually tried very very hard to grab both legacy lands from the local churches, try to tax them, and try to dismantle their “influence” on the religious followers, and it usually led to religious persecution like those few articles above.
To a communist government, the Church, and even Buddhist Temples, are political enemy and influencers that need to be minimized and subdued.
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I would say that it is best of giving of any kind. Guilt cannot be bought off.
Some tithe as a duty and I respect that, there is duty in the Christian life.
However, responding to the touch of the Holy Spirit’s leading to donate, or volunteer usually results in joy.
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Here are fellow Buddhist fighting in a religiously-estranged Vietnam
Now, at age 80, Nhat Hanh has turned his attention to healing the wounds of war in his communist-run native land. But his mission faces opposition from a surprising front — fellow Vietnamese Buddhists. Last week, Nhat Hanh arrived in the former Saigon for a 10-week tour, his second in two years. His plans include a series of three-day Buddhist mass-chanting ceremonies, the first starting March 16, to pray for the dead on all sides of the Vietnam War, unprecedented “Grand Requiem” ceremonies that Nhat Hanh’s followers hail as a leap forward in Communist-Buddhist relations.
But the banned Unified Buddhist Church of Vietnam sees Nhat Hanh’s pilgrimage as betrayal, not breakthrough. The UBCV’s two top officials, Thich Huyen Quang, and Thich Quang Do (“Thich” is an honorific held by most Vietnamese monks) have been under house arrest in their respective monasteries due to their pro-democracy stance and opposition to strict government control of religion, which was established after the communists won the war in 1975. A spokesman for the outlawed sect said he is “shocked” that Nhat Hanh is willing to work with his co-religionists’ oppressors. “I believe Thich Nhat Hanh’s trip is manipulated by the Hanoi government to hide its repression of the Unified Buddhist Church and create a false impression of religious freedom in Vietnam,” said Vo Van Ai, a Paris-based spokesman for the UBCV. About the Requiem plans, Ai said pointedly, “I think it is time to think about the living, not only the dead.”
Yeah I can see that as being true, during the entire Vietnam war with the US, Buddhists were in the center of being persecuted and the display of one setting themselves on fire was in protest of their unfair treatment by the government at the time as one example out of many conflicts they had. I am not sure about the history of Catholics there, but its not a stretch IMO to accept that they were there for awhile as well.
I’m a Calvinist, (reformed), I believe that God gave me (and all true believers) faith without any permission or request from me.
In the thesis of this thread, let’s not discuss that here. I don’t want to distract or derail.
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Here is some reading materials, if you have time. In short, commies used every excuse in the book to persecute you and grab your land
Vietnam’s communist leaders have long considered Christianity to be a US propaganda tool
https://vom.com.au/christian-persecution-in-communist-vietnam/