Never Let the Slaughter of Innocents Go to Waste

[montecresto1]

@Samm

They are both the law of the land, equally. An Amendment is just as much the Constitution as the rest of it.

Well sure, once added to the constitution, an amendment is as much the constitution as any other part. But then that was never in question.

[Samm]

@montecresto1

@Samm

Your obsession with this is ridiculous.

Well you should know what to do about that. Read a history book.

I have known all about it since I was in High School in the '60s … much before your Google searches.

[asaratis]

@montecresto1

Well you should know what to do about that. Read a history book.

I suggested an excellent history book to you. Have you made an effort to read it?

[montecresto1]

I went to high school too. Back when civics was actually taught.

[Samm]

Then why don’t you know how ratification works?

[montecresto1]

I’ve presented the facts of that to you clearly…

[TWR]

Sorry but no, he isn’t playing.

[TWR]

Without the promise of the BOR only two states would have ratified it and thus, no US would have been created.

Part of the deal for ratification was that they would all immediately begin the process of drafting the BOR which is the only way the other 11 original colonies would even put The Constitution before their states for a ratification vote.

[Samm]

@montecresto1

I’ve presented the facts of that to you clearly…

No you haven’t. In fact, I had to point out the fact that the Constitution and the Bill of Rights were ratified simultaneously in 1789. All votes within individual States prior to then were to approve ratification, but those votes did not ratify. Ratification occurs only once 3/4 of the States vote affirmatively to ratify. Why you refuse to understand that is beyond me. But then, as I said before, it makes no difference to the thread topic.

[montecresto1]

@Samm

No you haven’t. In fact, I had to point out the fact that the Constitution and the Bill of Rights were ratified simultaneously in 1789.

You claimed that the BOR was added at the CC. That’s false. The constitution was presented to the states in September of 1787 and they each took it home, held their own conventions and within ten months, nine of them had ratified it. All WITHOUT the BOR. the constitution had its first amendments in 1789.

DELAWARE AND EIGHT OTHER STATES RATIFIED THE CONSTITUTION ABSENT THE PEOPLES BILL OF RIGHTS…

The first state to ratify was Delaware , on December 7, 1787 , by a unanimous vote, 30 - 0. The featured document is an endorsed ratification of the federal Constitution by the Delaware convention. … When a bill of rights was proposed in Congress in 1789, North Carolina ratified the Constitution .

Observing Constitution Day

[Samm]

Clearly, you do not understand the requirement of 3/4 of the States voting to ratify before Ratification is executed and the document becomes legal.

Now why don’t you drop it and get back to the topic of the thread.

[montecresto1]

I was done with my last post when I showed you that 9 states each ratified the constitution well before the BOR was added to it. From the National Archives no less.

[Samm]

Whatever makes you feel superior. Now do you want to explain how it has anything what so ever to do with the topic or do you want to get back on track?

[TWR]

In short, No. …

[asaratis]

…and their ratification made the Constitution applicable only to those 9 states. As other states ratified, it became applicable to them…but it wasn’t officially the supreme law of the land until March 4, 1789.

North Carolina and Rhode Island ratified afterwards…making it official for all 13 states.

Order of States in Ratification of the US Constitution

Also:

To the lack of a Bill of Rights, the Federalists argued that such a list of rights would always be incomplete and that the Constitution as written adequately protected the people from the government. Finally, during the ratification debate in Virginia, James Madison promised that the first act of the new government under the Constitution would be the adoption of a Bill of Rights.

The Delaware legislature became the first to ratify the Constitution by a vote of 30-0 on December 7, 1787. The ninth state, New Hampshire, ratified it on June 21, 1788, and the new Constitution went into effect on March 4, 1789.

[montecresto1]

Just an amendment to this…

“By January 1788, Delaware, Pennsylvania, New Jersey, Georgia and Connecticut ratified the Constitution without insisting upon amendments.”

Second Amendment to the United States Constitution

So, to the very first point in this thread about this. The constitution was written without the second amendment or any of the other individual protections that were ADDED to it several years later. And 3/4’s of the states ratified (and accepted) the constitution absent the BOR.

[montecresto1]

@MarkDido

None of the above items woud have prevented the Va Beach shooting.

It would be interesting to here you articulate what would???

[MarkDido]

@montecresto1

@MarkDido

None of the above items woud have prevented the Va Beach shooting.

It would be interesting to here you articulate what would???

Not the topic of this thread.

Go troll somewhere else there champ.

You’re getting tedious

[Smiley321]

@asaratis

…and their ratification made the Constitution applicable only to those 9 states. As other states ratified, it became applicable to them…but it wasn’t officially the supreme law of the land until March 4, 1789.

Old man,You’re arguing with Jittsy, sans the microphone drop

The difference is, Jittsy actually seems to think that his reputation will suffer if he stops. This guy, I’m pretty sure, doesn’t care, I think that his troll farm just wants him to clutter up threads with junk.

[asaratis]

Yes, I agree…but if we don’t counter his lies, some pliable minds may be bent to believe them.

What I encourage is research and study of historical facts, not blind belief of undocumented statements by relentless idiots.