Basic Rights in the US

You’re incorrect. Public roads are a public benefit, not a personal benefit. A personal benefit is something that applies to the individual. Infrastructure isn’t the same.

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And patents are required to protect the inventors from the people duplicating their work.

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Well, let’s take that further. How about gym memberships and mandatory working out? Isn’t a healthy population a benefit to the public? Here’s the further problem… a single payer system wouldn’t make us healthier. It would actually reduce the quality of care and that’s obvious when you examine the results of other single payer systems and are careful to try to compare all of the variables.

Medicare isn’t a success as it’s broke and a pay as you go program just like SS.

The laughable part is they say it’s ok until 2026. As long as taxpayers keep shoveling in money.

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No. Medicare isn’t a success. It’s drive up the health care costs to the public by a massive amount. The quality is lower than what you get with private insurance. My parents paid into Medicare for 60 years and now when they need it, they have to buy Blue Cross/Blue Shield to cover the difference at a cost of $900 a month between the two of them. (Ok, I pay that cost but who’s counting?) What happens if they don’t pay that insurance to cover the gap? Bankruptcy. . . so essentially, people call Medicare a success and ignore that after 60 years of paying into a system, they still have to have insurance to keep them from going broke. . . HORRIBLE results but the second we mention that, we want to push Grandma off of a cliff.

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Regarding roads…
You should read this. It was national security that justified federal funding.

Please tell your handlers to find libs that have some knowledge of American history to send here to post under the name of “Pragmatic” :slight_smile:

That’s exactly correct. I want to start a new program for these folks. Give me $200 a month for 50 years and at the end of 50 years, I’ll pay for your health insurance… then at the end of 50 years, I’m going to charge your kids $200 a month to pay for YOUR insurance… they support failure because they can’t wrap their heads around how badly they’re being screwed. They want to look at a snap shot and say “See, seniors are getting care…”… yet they ignore the fact that for 50-60 years, they paid into the system without benefit… and every single dime of that cash was wasted on BULLSHIT we didn’t need or want.

And writing was a thing before copyrights.

And building was a thing before deeds.

And saving was a thing before banks.

But our writings, and property, and money are things we work for and deserve to keep and use however WE see fit. So we protect ourselves from theft. Intellectual property is no different.

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On my opinion, I don’t think it works unless every tax payer contribute something. However I can see a scenario where you can opt out OR stay in and get SOME money back when you file taxes if you haven’t utilized the government sponsored plans. USAA does that for auto insurance, I don’t get all of my money back but I can get a small portion back at the end of the year based on overall USAA insurance performance.

I see your perspective. I don’t 100% agree but I see where you are coming from.

Of course if you had millions of people to insurance that weren’t previously there… the system… as it is today… would cripple. I agree. But that shouldn’t be a reason why we don’t do it. It just means we have to build the appropriate infrastructure to support the influx of people.

I see that as a good thing.

medicare for all is one of the worst ideas next to taxing the uber rich 70% or higher.

You want to see what medicare for all does, go to the UK or look up the Charlie Gard case.

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Thanks. How does this contradict anything I said? Before you try being witty, you should really explain yourself better.

I don’t think cherry picking a single case is going to sway the argument one way or another. We can cite many cases in the US were our current healthcare system failed. We must address the entire system. And Medicare for all is a start, but it likely won’t end there.

Not to mention people pay into it all their lives and in the case of medicare people after they retire pay for Part B as well as supplemental plans as there is no max out of pocket.

People in this country either have their head in the sand or are incredibly stupid.

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There are many cases , I dont have the room or the time to post them all, that is the reality.

Our current system has problems because of inept politicians thinking they know better, and every solution they offer exacerbate the problem

Obamacare was a bad idea from the get go, romneycare in Massachusetts was a bad idea

Bottom line is healthcare is not a right and that is where the problem start, leftists preaching about healthcare is a right is why we have problems in the system.

Medicare for those who are 65 and older is a joke and as Texas husker pointed out , it drives up the costs.

People like Bernie and AOC cant see that , Bernie’s coverage is pretty damn good as a senator and AOC will find out how good it is as she is now a congresswoman.

The V.A is a mess and you think Medicare for all will solve this problem?

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That’s my problem with Medicare for all. I agree with you that it doesn’t work unless you force everyone to pay into the system. That means it’s not viable to me. Take a look at private insurance. It stands on its own without forced payments.

I’d argue that the demand is already there, it’s just that a lot of it goes unpaid for. In that regard, a single payer would be preferable but I don’t want to sacrifice quality for availability. I’d rather we back Medicare out of the private system with a flame on its ass (let’s be honest, it’s a tick!) and circle it back into a segregated system. If you want government provided health care, you pay into the system. If you don’t want it, you don’t get it but don’t expect us to pay for your cancer treatments if you opt out, then don’t have private insurance. I’d make them wholly dependent on charity at that point. Part of the problem we have is that we mandate care, then don’t cover the bill so health care companies are eating the cost of the people that refuse to pay… which drives up the cost to the rest of us.

There’s no easy solution but I think making it 100% government would be a disaster. I think making me pay for health care that I’m not directly benefiting from isn’t productive and encourages dependence on the government for a large number of people and that’s harmful to our country. Far more harmful than making people that don’t want to pay for their health care dependent on private charities.

Medicare for all.
A great start. A family of 4 belly’s up to the bar for 500 bucks a month for a plan that is 80/20 with no max out of pocket.

Want a supplement, 300 per person a month, no problem, 1700 a month. People who are unaware of what medicare costs beat the drum and should learn to read.

Yes indeed, medicare for all keep chanting the mantra of the stupid.

I don’t know the end solution. However I have a general problem with the fact that the health insurance business is for profit. It’s the same problem I have with for profit prison. When your primary goal is to make a profit you tend lose empathy for the person.